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Subject: The true victims (was: no subject)
From: Jon Goldberg <[log in to unmask]>
Reply-To:Jon Goldberg <[log in to unmask]>
Date:Tue, 5 Dec 2017 13:42:34 -0500
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I find it tragic and ironic that this discussion is largely leaving out the true tragic figures 
here - the hapless victims of Levine's sexual assaults. They are the ones it happened to, 
they are the ones that have to live with the resulting years of memories, shame, and 
helplessness. 

Levine brought this on himself, and yes, it is terrible that so many people have been 
affected one way or another by the revelations. But the most important people to 
consider are the young men and boys who were directly affected, physically and 
emotionally, by Levine's selfish and compulsive actions. They are the ones who deserve 
our utmost respect and acknowledgement. The tragedy is that they were undeservedly 
caught up in this at all. 

They cannot be forgotten or trivialized. And I feel to some extent our discussions are 
doing just that. These horrible things happened TO THEM. We cannot forget that. 



On Tue, 5 Dec 2017 11:54:31 -0600, Les Mitnick <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

>I've said nothing about this publicly on this Board because I wanted to know more and 
observe everyone else's comments, and Mr. Kane's thinking seems to be closely aligned 
with my own.  Mr. Levine was an artist whose career was second to none (a Time picture 
cover three decades ago stands as testimony) and he was idolized by many singers who 
loved working with him. I spent the whole day yesterday watching that spectacular 25th 
anniversary tribune from the Met, and I couldn't help thinking about these revelations 
about his perverse behavior.  My first question is that, given that it was an "open secret" 
in the opera world --------- why did it take so long to burst open?  I've read of the Met 
keeping a "hush fund", certain singers "covering and lying" for him, and the like.  Most 
disturbing, I even read that Mr. Levine actually inflicted physical pain on one of the men 
who have come forward.
>    A great conductor he was, certainly.  Moreover, his recordings and DVDs certainly 
should NOT be banned and withdrawn --- out of respect to the contributions of so many 
great singers who participated in these projects.  Besides, there are so MANY that it 
would create a not inconsiderable gap in the general classical music catalogue.
>    If the Met WAS paying out "hush money", then it's up to whomever to determine 
how complicit the Met could have been in this matter.  If there WERE payouts, under 
WHO's administration did it take place?  Also, did the Board authorize these "hush 
payments"?  
>    When all is said and done, we have here an artist and musician who was a paragon 
of musical genius. He was also a real creep with a very dark side.
>    Lastly, it is Mr. Levine who DOES take the ultimate downfall here.  What a way to 
end a fifty year career in music.  The tragedy is his alone and a tragedy it surely is.  
>> On December 5, 2017 at 7:46 AM donald kane <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> Gelb called it "a tragedy for everyone involved" or some such words.
>> 
>> It is no such thing; Levine stands alone as the tragic figure in all this.
>> He alone persisted in yielding to a deviant sexual appetite, and thereby
>> betrayed the millions who held him in respect for his unique artistic
>> gifts.
>> 
>> The embarrassment, inconvenience, or discomfort that these untimely
>> allegations have aroused are not the elements of tragedy, but of pathos.
>> 
>> dtmk
>> 
>> On Mon, Dec 4, 2017 at 7:14 PM, Stephen Charitan <[log in to unmask]>
>> wrote:
>> 
>> > I  can almost sense your erotic frisson as you slobbered over your
>> > keyboard.to report this transgression...
>> >
>> > Of course one presumes such things simply don't happen in Paris or amongst
>> > the revelers of the FĂȘte champĂȘtre you experience daily in the bucolic
>> > paradise of St. Ninny de Fol de rol...
>> >
>> > Never, Never, change - YOU are perfect as you are - and never cease to
>> > amuse!
>> >
>> > On Mon, Dec 4, 2017 at 6:16 PM, Frank Cadenhead <[log in to unmask]>
>> > wrote:
>> >
>> > > Headline in Playbill Classic Arts...
>> > >
>> > > "Peter Martins, leader of New York City Ballet, is being investigated
>> > over
>> > > a sexual
>> > > harassment allegation"
>> > >
>> > > Frank Cadenhead
>> > >
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