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Subject: Re: "Presumption of Innocence (was Re: James Levine Incidents)
From: Paul Ricchi <[log in to unmask]>
Reply-To:Paul Ricchi <[log in to unmask]>
Date:Mon, 4 Dec 2017 23:17:37 +0000
Content-Type:text/plain
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Max,  you risk making a lot of enemies on this list withyour calm and
rational commentary.

On Mon, Dec 4, 2017 at 4:06 PM Max D. Winter <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> In response to John Rahbeck's question: yes, the statute of limitations
> applies in criminal
> cases as well as in civil ones.  As far as I know, murder is the only
> crime for which there is
> no statute of limitations.
>
> And not to be pedantic, but (this is a pet peeve of mine) the "presumption
> of innocence" is
> only applicable in criminal proceedings.  Outside of a courtroom, there is
> no "presumption of
> innocence" and whether one is inclined to believe a particular accusation
> is more a matter of
> basic fairness and common sense depending on the circumstances.  For
> example, I am
> under no obligation to presume the innocence of Hillary Clinton re her
> email skullduggery or
> of Roy Moore for the sexual abuse allegations against him.  The former
> because she has a
> long history of deceit and corrupt actions and the email mess is
> characteristic of her well-
> demonstrated paranoia and above-the-law attitude; and the latter because I
> find Moore's
> accusers to be credible, based on the known facts.  (The fact that I also
> regard Moore as a
> know-nothing demagogue admittedly may influence my feelings about the
> allegations
> against him.)
>
> On the other hand, if someone with a clear axe to grind makes an
> outrageous, unsupported
> accusation against someone with no evidence to back it up, basic fairness
> - not a
> "presumption of innocence" - would dictate withholding judgment.  Factors
> that go into
> withholding judgment include the records and respective credibilities of
> the accused and the
> accuser, possible motives for making a false accusation, any other
> independent accusations
> of similar behavior, and any evidence to support the charge.  In Levine's
> case, there is
> ample justification for someone to believe his accusers: the separate
> accounts of those men
> demonstrate a clear pattern of behavior, and in one case there is
> independent corroborating
> evidence.  Do we know anything to a moral certainty?  Obviously not.  But
> to say that it is
> unreasonable or unfair for people to draw conclusions, based on what we
> know, is
> nonsense.
>
> MDW
>
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