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Subject: Re: Pretentious Quotes
From: Stephen Charitan <[log in to unmask]>
Reply-To:Stephen Charitan <[log in to unmask]>
Date:Wed, 15 Mar 2017 19:45:48 -0400
Content-Type:text/plain
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That Azucena in "A Night at the Opera" is the "Azucena of Azucenas."   As
soon as she appears on screen my funny bone is automatically activated
because she is every cliché about the character one could imagine...The
hair alone....What brilliant, satirical, pinpoint accuracy thrived at MGM
in the '30's!  Would love to know the unsung hero / heroine who was
responsible for this "masterpiece" within a "masterpiece" within a
"masterpiece..."
"


On Wed, Mar 15, 2017 at 7:08 PM, Paul Ricchi <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> All of which brings back a memory, about 7 decades ago, of a cheesy little
> TV listing booklet that came with the Sunday newspaper.
>
> The listing for "A Night at the Opera", illustrated with character
> portraits of Groucho's character, and Azucena at her most demented read:
> "The Marx Brothers, doing to IL Trovatore exactly what it deserves."
>
> Decades later, at a dinner, I  met a psychiatrist who had just been to the
> opera for the first time -Trovatore. She was astounded, "the mother,
> presents a classic case of acute post-traumatic distress disorder". She
> said, " Whoever wrote the book did not diagnose, but he almost certainly
> had witnessed it."
>
> It is always dangerous to be dismissive of performing  works that  that
> have attracted audiences for over a century, just as dangerous as radical
> reinterpretations. Fools fall into these traps.
>
> Paul Ricchi
>
>
> On Wed, Mar 15, 2017 at 10:51 AM donald kane <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
> > It has been clear for quite some time now, that "GCR" gets satisfaction
> > out of digging up provocative statements about opera from a variety of
> > sources, and posting them to see what happens.  What's wrong with that?
> > Can't we just get used to it, the way we have to get used to a tsunami of
> > conflicting data on when, where, and how a celebrated diva sang what, as,
> > currently in the case of Leontyne Price,  around whom the waters have
> still
> > not receded?  Nothing new about any of it.
> >
> > As a matter of fact, the belittling of opera's stature as a form, in
> > relation
> > to the art of music in its entirety, is understandable, and depending on
> > the musical historians being quoted, more than justified as food for
> > thought.
> > What I do question is the purpose of offering quotations under the name
> > "anonymous".  Who wants to agree or disagree with him?
> >
> > dtmk
> >
> > On Tue, Mar 14, 2017 at 11:54 PM, Jon Goldberg <[log in to unmask]>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > Boy how you do seem to be (*seem* to be???) obsessed with some
> fabricated
> > > "class
> > > system" of operas and with "serious study" of opera. So many of your
> > > quote-pulling posts
> > > seem to echo these concepts. One would think by now you'd want to talk
> > > about something
> > > else, lol.
> > >
> > > That said - in the world at large (i.e. not in our little
> opera-obsessed
> > > bubble), there is most
> > > likely no such thing as "middlebrow" opera. For lots of people, opera
> in
> > > general *is* boring,
> > > partially because it's seen as being so pretentiously highbrow. We know
> > > that perception is
> > > wrong, but still that perception exists. (And the same goes for
> > > perceptions about classical
> > > music in general, of course.)
> > >
> > > Ironically, I think it's only the most self-important, self-proclaimed
> > > "highbrow" opera fans
> > > who rate popular operas as "boringly middlebrow." Personally, I find
> > those
> > > kind of so-called
> > > opera fans boringly faux-highbrow, and really don't want to have
> anything
> > > to do with them.
> > >
> > > I like a good mix of the standards AND the more obscure, adventurous
> rep,
> > > as I assume
> > > most all of us do (save you and Mr. Grossman, lol). I see no problem in
> > > that. I think Mr.
> > > Grossman should be permanently locked in a padded cell with some of
> that
> > > typical
> > > Hollywood fodder (whatever that means) and some really boring Aida
> Boheme
> > > and
> > > Carmen. I think that would be proper Mikado-like punishment. ;-)
> > >
> > >
> > > On Tue, 14 Mar 2017 22:55:54 -0400, Genevieve Castle Room
> > > <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> > >
> > > >>1) Most works in the standard (i.e., boringly middlebrow) operatic
> > > >repertoire do not warrant serious study and deserve to be seen no more
> > > than
> > > >typical Hollywood fodder.
> > > >
> > > >(Andrew Grossman)
> > >
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